The Ranting Thread

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by SarcasticRocker86

I see... so the name is "Ry" in the manga, technically? That's interesting.

I think the only suitable solution for this is just to learn Japanese. Yea, that's it. Limey Man away!

Well, not exactly. There's just nothing between the "R" and "y," it's, Ry?/Ryou, with an "ou' after the Ry, but it's all basically one syllable.

Hahaha, yes, learn Japanese. Actually, you don't even need to learn Japanese, you can get away with learning pronunciations.

[AllisonWalker]

This is making my head hurt now.
>_<

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by AllisonWalker

This is making my head hurt now.
>_<

It's not that difficult, really. Ryou's name is pronounced "Ryo/Ryou," just as it looks, the "o/ou" sound is the same as at the end of "Yuugiou," but it's technically all one syllable, without break... ._. It's easier when you can actually just say it to the person.

[AllisonWalker]

Okay.
U:

[sugar_beets]

Isn't it Ryo (with the line over the o)? in the English Manga? So the o wouldn't have some sort of pronunciation?

I read your thing. Even if I tried, I wouldn't be able to pronounce those properly.

[SarcasticRocker86]

Originally Posted by sugar_beets

Isn't it Ry? in the English Manga? So the o wouldn't have some sort of pronunciation?

I read your thing. Even if I tried, I wouldn't be able to pronounce those properly.

Yea, I think it's a "you have to actually hear it" thing.

I'm pretty sure it's "Ryo" in the English manga. I remember looking at the name again and again to make sure I had the spelling write for one of my fanfics =/

[sugar_beets]

Arg, the O with the line over top didn't go through

[SarcasticRocker86]

Ooooohhh! I don't remember a line, but I'll take your word for it.

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by sugar_beets

Isn't it Ry? in the English Manga? So the o wouldn't have some sort of pronunciation?

I read your thing. Even if I tried, I wouldn't be able to pronounce those properly.

It's difficult, I have a lot of trouble saying it, too.

I'm pretty sure it's "Ryo" in the English manga. I remember looking at the name again and again to make sure I had the spelling write for one of my fanfics =/

Well Ryo's not necessarily "wrong" (though there should be a line above the o) there's just a pronunciation difference between English and Japanese, the line above the o (or when you simply write it 'Ryou') shows that it's supposed to be a... long o? I believe. Like when you say Yuugou, the "ou" sound at the very end is what gets mixed with the "Ry."

[sugar_beets]

Originally Posted by SarcasticRocker86

Yea, I think it's a "you have to actually hear it" thing.

I'm pretty sure it's "Ryo" in the English manga. I remember looking at the name again and again to make sure I had the spelling write for one of my fanfics =/

Haha ya, it is Ryo except to O has a little line over it that the site didn't post

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by sugar_beets

Haha ya, it is Ryo except to O has a little line over it that the site didn't post

Haha, yeah, the o with the line over it doesn't wanna post here, I just realized that... But regardless, you can easily find it on a character map.

[sugar_beets]

Or just know the alt code! (I don't. I just copy/paste from character map/internet)

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by sugar_beets

Or just know the alt code! (I don't. I just copy/paste from character map/internet)

Yeah, copying from the character map is always nice, but evidently, the site doesn't read special characters, just turns them into "?" hahaha. It's like trying to paste Kanji, it doesn't work out well.

[Daeth]

I have a question.
What are the possibilities of Ryou developing Stockholm syndrome. I mean, that would give tendershipping sort of a base.

He hates Bakura but with continuous psychological abuse, I don't think it's too far-fetched to assume that this is possible.

Just a thought.

[Anreyla]

I'm of a particular mindset that believes Ryou might already have Stockholm Syndrome, I mean.. In the manga, he steals back the Millennium Ring from Yuugi, knowing full well the implications and what would come along with it. Understand that Stockholm Syndrome isn't only falling in love with your captor (that's in extreme cases of the already extreme condition), it's also just caring for their general wellbeing (like when people are being held hostage and develop Stockholm Syndrome and try to defend their captor from arrest-- it's a bit like Battered Wife Syndrome if you think about it). It's either that Ryou is quite ignorant/gullible (In the season one version of the manga, Bakura tells him he's 'turned a new leaf,' and Ryou believes him, albeit skeptically, even after he turned Ryou's friends into Monster World pieces), Bakura is really persuasive, or Ryou is simply already mentally fucked up. (Or any combination thereof)

Or that's my opinion, anyway. I don't really advocate for writers to use Stockholm Syndrome, since most people tend to screw it up.

[Daeth]

Originally Posted by Anreyla

I'm of a particular mindset that believes Ryou might already have Stockholm Syndrome, I mean.. In the manga, he steals back the Millennium Ring from Yuugi, knowing full well the implications and what would come along with it. Understand that Stockholm Syndrome isn't only falling in love with your captor (that's in extreme cases of the already extreme condition), it's also just caring for their general wellbeing (like when people are being held hostage and develop Stockholm Syndrome and try to defend their captor from arrest-- it's a bit like Battered Wife Syndrome if you think about it). It's either that Ryou is quite ignorant/gullible (In the season one version of the manga, Bakura tells him he's 'turned a new leaf,' and Ryou believes him, albeit skeptically, even after he turned Ryou's friends into Monster World pieces), Bakura is really persuasive, or Ryou is simply already mentally fucked up. (Or any combination thereof)

Or that's my opinion, anyway. I don't really advocate for writers to use Stockholm Syndrome, since most people tend to screw it up.

*nods*
I know. I didn't mean that he would be in love with Bakura. And I don't really see him as gullible. I think he is one of those tortured genious types. If he spends so much time alone, and he has strange interests, he would accumulate a vast knowledge of things. So believing Bakura has turned over a new leaf? I don't think so no...
But I have no doubt he's mentally not all there. The trauma of the loss of his family and then being stuck with a demented spirit and al the shit he put him through would definitely contribute to that.
Not to mention that Bakura is the other half of his soul so that could also contribute to a form of Stockholm syndrome...?

LOL it's not just that that they get wrong you know. Why is it so hard to find good writing?

[Anreyla]

Well I don't think Ryou is gullible, but he does believe Bakura (in the manga) when he tells him that he's turned a new leaf, and even more so when he actually helps Yuugi(Atem, technically, but who's keeping track) and Jounouchi win that duel against theweirdguysinthecavewhosenamesIcanneverremember.

Yeahhh, as sugar_beets put it, Kazuki Takahashi is a bitch to his characters, he's really mean to most of them, and Ryou is no exception. He lost his mother and sister, his father is away most of the time, he had a spirit of 3000 years past thrusted upon him, and basically no one can distinguish between him and YBakura sometimes. I wouldn't say 'other half of his soul' (that's from the lovely recursive fanon we're all so very fond of, I believe), but it's the other soul in his heart/mind, they're connected through the ring, even if in a miniscule way, and Bakura's mental torture would probably drive him over the edge, especially given his situation (living alone, everything is relatively silent, and something just keeps whispering to you, telling you horrible things that you don't want to believe... no matter how strong-willed you are, it'll get to you eventually.)

Yeeeeah they get everything wrong, not just SS, but as Battered Wife Syndrome as I mentioned earlier... The two are quite similar, it's just a matter of when the relationship develops (before/after/(during) the abuse/attacks/etc). With SS, people slowly begin to think highly of their captor, thinking they're merciful for letting them live, that they're wonderful and all of that kind of nonsense; this occurs, obviously, in a situation where the person generally has no knowledge of/connection to the offender. In BWS, the opposite is true, the victim still believes their captor is good and they deserve the treatment, but the relationship started before the abuse, it may've started out seemingly healthy, and when things took a turn for the worse, the victim just couldn't walk away.

>_> Sorry, that's been bugging me, I've seen some people messing both of those up recently, it annoys me.

[Daeth]

Originally Posted by Anreyla

Well I don't think Ryou is gullible, but he does believe Bakura (in the manga) when he tells him that he's turned a new leaf, and even more so when he actually helps Yuugi(Atem, technically, but who's keeping track) and Jounouchi win that duel against theweirdguysinthecavewhosenamesIcanneverremember.

Yeahhh, as sugar_beets put it, Kazuki Takahashi is a bitch to his characters, he's really mean to most of them, and Ryou is no exception. He lost his mother and sister, his father is away most of the time, he had a spirit of 3000 years past thrusted upon him, and basically no one can distinguish between him and YBakura sometimes. I wouldn't say 'other half of his soul' (that's from the lovely recursive fanon we're all so very fond of, I believe), but it's the other soul in his heart/mind, they're connected through the ring, even if in a miniscule way, and Bakura's mental torture would probably drive him over the edge, especially given his situation (living alone, everything is relatively silent, and something just keeps whispering to you, telling you horrible things that you don't want to believe... no matter how strong-willed you are, it'll get to you eventually.)

Yeeeeah they get everything wrong, not just SS, but as Battered Wife Syndrome as I mentioned earlier... The two are quite similar, it's just a matter of when the relationship develops (before/after/(during) the abuse/attacks/etc). With SS, people slowly begin to think highly of their captor, thinking they're merciful for letting them live, that they're wonderful and all of that kind of nonsense; this occurs, obviously, in a situation where the person generally has no knowledge of/connection to the offender. In BWS, the opposite is true, the victim still believes their captor is good and they deserve the treatment, but the relationship started before the abuse, it may've started out seemingly healthy, and when things took a turn for the worse, the victim just couldn't walk away.

>_> Sorry, that's been bugging me, I've seen some people messing both of those up recently, it annoys me.

Haha sorry, I am not actually English so sometimes I have trouble phrasing what I want to say or it gets confused with something else. I was actually trying to talk about the connection. *shot for idiocy* So that would suggest he trusts Bakura, right?

I just want to rant about something quickley. Why do people write Bakura and Touzuku-ou (I'm sorry if I spelled that wrong) with similar personalities so often? Bakura is a fusion between his original soul and Zork but Zork is predominantly featured in the fusion. Zork is the manifestation of evil. The Thief King was never 'evil' in that sense. They are two totally different people mannn >_>
Another thing that bugs me to no end is how fan-girls write them as sex-crazed hormonal things that want's to sleep with everything that moves. ??????????????? WTFis that about? O_O>_>;;;

Anyway, yes, if you take into account Ryou's sircumstanses as well as the influence of Bakura, however subtle, I am quite certain it could lead to a form of SS - since he was exposed to it over a long period of time. He would kind of know that Bakura is the 'bad guy' but still feel the need to defend him?

Does it even make sense?

[SarcasticRocker86]

Originally Posted by Anreyla

I'm of a particular mindset that believes Ryou might already have Stockholm Syndrome, I mean.. In the manga, he steals back the Millennium Ring from Yuugi, knowing full well the implications and what would come along with it. Understand that Stockholm Syndrome isn't only falling in love with your captor (that's in extreme cases of the already extreme condition), it's also just caring for their general wellbeing (like when people are being held hostage and develop Stockholm Syndrome and try to defend their captor from arrest-- it's a bit like Battered Wife Syndrome if you think about it). It's either that Ryou is quite ignorant/gullible (In the season one version of the manga, Bakura tells him he's 'turned a new leaf,' and Ryou believes him, albeit skeptically, even after he turned Ryou's friends into Monster World pieces), Bakura is really persuasive, or Ryou is simply already mentally fucked up. (Or any combination thereof)

Or that's my opinion, anyway. I don't really advocate for writers to use Stockholm Syndrome, since most people tend to screw it up.

It's really under debate. I've noticed that manga Ryou and anime Ryou are almost two different people. Their personalities seem to differ for me so much.

Take the last Egypt arc. Wherein the anime Bakura is running from the spirit in the first scene, in the manga when he isn't allowed to enter the Millennium World he runs off crying.

I really do think manga Ryou suffers from Stockholm Syndrome. You definitely get the feeling. But as far as the anime, that's under debate.

[fuzwuz07]

Originally Posted by Daeth

I just want to rant about something quickley. Why do people write Bakura and Touzuku-ou (I'm sorry if I spelled that wrong) with similar personalities so often? Bakura is a fusion between his original soul and Zork but Zork is predominantly featured in the fusion. Zork is the manifestation of evil. The Thief King was never 'evil' in that sense. They are two totally different people mannn >_>

Random much, but would you care to expand on that rant? (You've got an audience for a rant, zomg!) I'm writing a Bakura fic, and for me the best way to nail a character is to see how NOT to do it. I've been scouring all over for Thief King/Bakura rants, but most of what I find are Bakura/Ryou rants. Which are good, it's just, not what I'm looking for ^^

[Anreyla]

Okay, since everyone's replies are too long to keep quoting, I'll just use @ symbols, >_>.

@Daeth:
In the manga? Maybe. In the anime? Nooot so much. I don't know if it's so much about trusting him than Bakura just hammering it into his head until he can't believe anything else. It's not like when you have a fight with someone and you can just walk away, for Ryou, that someone is in his head, no matter what he does, he can't escape from it. The way I see Touzoku-ou Bakura is really just a few steps from YBakura; he's not 'evil' on YBakura's level of evil-- I hesitate to really call him evil(and not only because I think the word evil is stupid), he was driven by righteous motivation, whereas YBakura, being mostly Zorc, probably doesn't give two fucks about Kul Elna anymore. I've never understood why people make the two total horndogs, either, it's ridiculous. YBakura-- sure, he was imprisoned for 3000 years, but he's barely human anymore, he probably doesn't care about sex anymore, and it wouldn't be super-kinky stuff, it'd be purely animalistic 'get this shit done' type of thing.

@SarcasticRocker86
I take the manga to be the purest form of canon, and yeah, he really does seem different between manga and anime (though the anime shows him even less than the manga does). Poor Ryou, he has one of the worst backstories and then he just gets treated as a vessel for YBakura. :|

@Fuzwuz07
Well, there's not much to say exactly. TK Bakura is driven more by righteous revenge for his village, whereas YBakura (being primarily made up of Zorc) is just driven by the desire to end the world with the Millennium Items. Figuratively speaking, Touzoku-ou is the lesser of the two evils, by far.

[fuzwuz07]

@Anreyla

Darn, I thought there was a wicked rant hiding there.
Oh well, thanks for answering though.

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by fuzwuz07

@Anreyla

Darn, I thought there was a wicked rant hiding there.
Oh well, thanks for answering though.

I could give you a wicked rant if you want, I've been doing that a lot recently for a lot of stuff, hahah. Here's goes nothing~...

Touzoku-ou Bakura, as mentioned, is after righteous revenge against the pharaoh because he thought it was his fault that his village was destroyed (though it was actually Akhenaden who ordered the destruction of Kul Elna to make the Millennium Items). In this respect, Touzoku-ou Bakura really isn't a 'villain' by standards of that society (as usual, I use the Set and Osiris example. Set killed Osiris, but Set isn't considered 'evil' in ancient Egyptian religion), he's a 'villain' because he challenged the pharaoh. He was corrupted by Zorc, but before that, you couldn't really call him "evil."

My interpretation (and that of most fans) is that YBakura is a mix of the Thief King and Zorc, with Zorc being the dominant piece. Some fans go as far to say that YBakura is only Zorc, but I doubt that because if it were only Zorc, he wouldn't need a specific host (Ryou), he could just pick one at random. YBakura's primary focus is to gather the seven Millennium Items and, y'know, destroy the world and whatnot. (Another reason I feel he has to at least be partially made up of the Thief King is because he has an interest especially in Atem. He wouldn't know why though, since he has no memory of his life in ancient Egypt.) YBakura is about as close to "evil" as you can really get (along with YMalik) in Yuugiou, since he's made up mostly of Zorc, the ultimate manifestation of evil in their canon lore.

(I do find it amusing, however, that in seasons one to five, YBakura is trying to open the 'door of darkness,' but in season zero, Atem does it all the time... There's a few explanations I thought of: The door knob jammed, Atem broke it, or, as Basketcat put it, they accidentally locked the key inside.)

This isn't quite as long as I would've liked, but if you have any questions, feel free to ask.

[fuzwuz07]

Oh good, I'm not too far off with my story then :)

Thanks for indulging me.

[SarcasticRocker86]

Originally Posted by Anreyla

I could give you a wicked rant if you want, I've been doing that a lot recently for a lot of stuff, hahah. Here's goes nothing~...

My interpretation (and that of most fans) is that YBakura is a mix of the Thief King and Zorc, with Zorc being the dominant piece. Some fans go as far to say that YBakura is only Zorc, but I doubt that because if it were only Zorc, he wouldn't need a specific host (Ryou), he could just pick one at random.

This isn't quite as long as I would've liked, but if you have any questions, feel free to ask.

Not technically true about the host thing. He could just take about any host devoid of a soul (as he wanted Mokuba Kaiba's body because it was soulless and w/o resistance)

By the way, I was looking over the manga, and I noticed in the Egyptian arc Ryou does say "I hate him!" as he runs out crying from the museum But I don't know who it is targeted at; Bobassa (sp?), Yuugi, or YBakura... As far as the SS question goes, if it was indeed directed at YBakura than that would answer something.

[Anreyla]

Originally Posted by SarcasticRocker86

Not technically true about the host thing. He could just take about any host devoid of a soul (as he wanted Mokuba Kaiba's body because it was soulless and w/o resistance)

By the way, I was looking over the manga, and I noticed in the Egyptian arc Ryou does say "I hate him!" as he runs out crying from the museum But I don't know who it is targeted at; Bobassa (sp?), Yuugi, or YBakura... As far as the SS question goes, if it was indeed directed at YBakura than that would answer something.

Aah, that's very true, I forgot about that.

I'm pretty sure he meant YBakura there, he was the reason Ryou couldn't enter the Millennium World. He may not necessarily 'love' him, but as I said, that's not the only effect of SS, it's also simply caring for the well-being of that other person/people. There are regressions of 'I hate him/her/them!' (Just like in Battered Wife Syndrome), but the idea that the person is good is reinforced, in the case of SS, mainly by the individual suffering from it. Well, that's usually where the reinforcement comes from to begin with, sometimes it's from the other person, but that's usually in cases like BWS.

[SarcasticRocker86]

Originally Posted by Anreyla

Aah, that's very true, I forgot about that.

I'm pretty sure he meant YBakura there, he was the reason Ryou couldn't enter the Millennium World. He may not necessarily 'love' him, but as I said, that's not the only effect of SS, it's also simply caring for the well-being of that other person/people. There are regressions of 'I hate him/her/them!' (Just like in Battered Wife Syndrome), but the idea that the person is good is reinforced, in the case of SS, mainly by the individual suffering from it. Well, that's usually where the reinforcement comes from to begin with, sometimes it's from the other person, but that's usually in cases like BWS.

I suppose.

This is a random thought but, did anyone else feel really bad when the real TK Bakura came to and was promptly turned into dust? Because I felt awful. And that line? "Unnecessary cheese certainly have to disappear"? That was the icing on the cake for me. Made me think about how badly it must suck for any host of an unwanted, parasitic spirit.

Again, that was out of nowhere. But it occurred to me as I thought about the conversation of SS and such.

[sugar_beets]

Actually, I laughed. I'm a horrible person.

And since I don't have anything to actually say on this topic (too tired, brain is fried), this is my small rant. I hate the humor section at ff.net. Hate it. It sucked in 2003 and it sucks now. Sugar-high randomness is NOT funny. Using someone else's jokes isn't funny either. Gah. I usually read the other genres but sometimes it would be nice to read something with a bit of real humor.

[MonkeyBusiness]

same.

[SarcasticRocker86]

Originally Posted by sugar_beets

Actually, I laughed. I'm a horrible person.

And since I don't have anything to actually say on this topic (too tired, brain is fried), this is my small rant. I hate the humor section at ff.net. Hate it. It sucked in 2003 and it sucks now. Sugar-high randomness is NOT funny. Using someone else's jokes isn't funny either. Gah. I usually read the other genres but sometimes it would be nice to read something with a bit of real humor.

I'm not really, either. But I have read a few rare gems in a sea of crack fics.

I agree that most suck, though. But think about it, most are teens who think just saying penis again and again or inserting some stupid political pun constitutes as a joke. It would make sense that they suck.